Page 1 2 3 

Closed Topic Closed
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
How much water in the Brine tank?
 Login/Join
 
posted
What is the Ideal water level in a brine tank?


One Love, One God and Only One Way
 
Posts: 297 | Location: South of Lake Michigan | Registered: 25 August 2005Report This Post
<genpop>
posted
that would be specific to your clinic. depends on the amount of time you have set for brine draw. you need adequate water for that cycle, and you can adust you brine refill times also. state inspectors like to see salt pellets OVER the water level, also.
hope this helps
 
Report This Post
<2short>
posted
Not sure that last reply would be such a good idea as salt pellets tend to "bridge" when the water is below the top of the salt leaving a large cavity in the bottom of the brine tank. It is not possible to oversalinate water as it will only accept so many Na molecules. -2short
 
Report This Post
<Midwest-biomed>
posted
PB,genpop is right, the state inspectors here will give you a deficiency if the salt isn't above the water line.
 
Report This Post
posted Hide Post
thanks for the advice guys


One Love, One God and Only One Way
 
Posts: 297 | Location: South of Lake Michigan | Registered: 25 August 2005Report This Post
posted Hide Post
Caution, long answer approaching...

The ideal water level in the brine tank depends on how much resin is in your softener and what dose of salt you want to use. The more salt you expose the resin to during a regeneration, the more efficient the regeneration. For example, if you use 15 lbs salt per cubic foot of resin during a regeneration, you should get around 30,000 grains capacity per cubic foot of resin. If you use 6 lbs/ft3, you should get around 20,000 grains/ft3 capacity. Therefore, if you have a 3 cubic foot softener, you should use 45 lbs of salt per regeneration to get 90,000 grains of capacity, or 18 lbs of salt per regeneration to get 60,000 grains of capacity.

How much salt you use during the regeneration depends on how much water you put in the brine tank. The water will saturate with salt at 26.4% solution (this is temperature dependent). Therefore, you will dissolve 264 grams of salt per liter of water (or 2.2 lbs of salt per gallon of water). For a 3 ft3 softener, if you want to use 45 lbs of salt per regeneration, you need to add about 20.5 gallons of water to the brine tank. If you want to use 18 lbs of salt, you need to add a little over 8 gallons of water to the brine tank. Do the calculation for your softener. Too little water will not provide a good regeneration and you may get a small amount of hard water while the softener is running and the softener may exhaust before the next regeneration. Too much water is also a problem. The Brine Draw step of the regeneration is actually 2 steps of the regeneration; Brine Draw and Slow Rinse. At the beginning of this step, the brine solution is drawn into the softener. After all of the brine solution has been drawn into the softener, an air check valve in your brine tube closes. This is a small ball check valve at the bottom of your brine tube in the Brine Tank and it prevents air from being sucked into the softener after all of the brine solution has been drawn into the softener (Brine Tank is empty of solution). The valve on the softener head does not change, so without the brine solution being pulled into the softener, the softener begins the SLOW RINSE step to rinse out the brine solution in the softener. After the Slow Rinse, you should have a Fast Rinse step. The regen valve on the softener will change to provide a higher flowrate for the Fast Rinse step. If you have too much water in your brine tank, you shorten the slow rinse step because it takes longer to draw in all of the brine solution. This will reduce the contact time that the brine solution has with the resin and the shortened Slow Rinse step may result in brine being left in the softener after the Fast Rinse step.

Some of you may have a float valve in your Brine Tank to stop water from entering the Brine Tank if the water level in the Brine Tank get too high.

How much water that enters your brine tank depends on the length of time in your Brine Refill step of the regeneration, the flow restricter in your softener, and the water pressure. If the flow restrictor is partially blocked, you will not get enough water in your brine tank. If you have low water pressure while the brine tank is filling, you may not get enough water in your brine tank. If the time is too long, you may get too much water in your brine tank.

genpop is right, the salt pellets need to be OVER the water level. Yes, you do have a potential to bridge the salt, but there is a technical reason for the salt to be over the water level. Any water that is above the salt will not become saturated with salt. Water that is saturated with salt (brine solution) is heavier than the raw water. This brine solution will sink to the bottom of the Brine Tank and the unsaturated raw water will stay on the top of the Brine Tank. When the unsaturated water is drawn into the softener during the regeneration, it will not have enough salt in it to regenerate the resin. Therefore, you may not get a good regeneration. Some of you may have a false bottom in your brine tank. When the water around the salt is saturated, it will sink to below this false bottom and displace the water that does not have contact with the salt. Therefore, water below the salt is ok. Water above the salt is not ok.

If you can not keep the salt above the water level, you need to install something to mix the water in the brine tank. I have seen air spargers installed to mix the solution in the Brine Tank to cause the water above the salt to become saturated with salt.

Easiest way to determine how much water is in your brine tank is to track how much salt you are using....45 lbs per regeneration, 30 lbs per regeneration, etc. As long as you have at least 4 hours between regenerations and the water level is not above the salt level, the salt should have enough time to saturate the water and become your brine solution.

This may be more than what you were asking for, but hopefully it helped.


The Water Guy - Florian Services
 
Posts: 617 | Location: Chicago | Registered: 24 January 2005Report This Post
posted Hide Post
WOW Florian You are the man. Yes a little more than i expected but very good explaination. Thanks I will check into how much salt i am using per regen thanks again PB


One Love, One God and Only One Way
 
Posts: 297 | Location: South of Lake Michigan | Registered: 25 August 2005Report This Post
posted Hide Post
Florian,
I think that was worth at least 1 credit hour! Wink
great explaination!
 
Posts: 269 | Location: Florida | Registered: 01 December 2006Report This Post
<2short>
posted
I stand corrected, thanks Florian and my apologies for not doing my homework before opening my mouth. -2short.
 
Report This Post
<the_scot>
posted
quote:
reduce

Florian , one crucial error in your reply. At the end of your second paragraph, you state that the increase of brine will reduce contact time of brine with resin when the opposite is true.
 
Report This Post
<bmoore>
posted
if there is too much water in the tank, how can you decrease the water level to below the salt line?
 
Report This Post
posted Hide Post
First of all, if you have the ability, you can increase the level of the salt.

To decrease the water level in the salt you can reduce the time of the Brine Refill step. Or you can reduce the flow restrictor between the softener and the brine tank. If the brine tank has too much water, the flow restrictor may have failed. Some flow restrictors are pressure sensitive, therefore too high pressure can increase the amount of water in your brine tank.

Or, change the air check valve in your brine tank to include a high water level float. If the water level gets too high, the float will shutoff the water.


The Water Guy - Florian Services
 
Posts: 617 | Location: Chicago | Registered: 24 January 2005Report This Post
<VS>
posted
the water level is well above salt in my brine tank and I want to fix it. my system is set to use 8lb of salt for each generation. this is what i am thinking. empty the brine tank completely. put 80lb of salt in the tank. now question is how many gallons of water should i add? will i need to add water periodically or will the brine tank get filled automatically by the system?
 
Report This Post
<AreaChiefTech>
posted
After returning to several clinics after being gone for several years I noticed that the water level was always about the salt level in each brine Tank. (As Florian stated this is no good from a technical standpoint and can also increase bacteria levels in the softener)
After checking everything I found there were no grids or "risers" in the brine tanks. Broke em' down and installed the risers and bingo, dirty job done.
Come to find out the last tech was throwing the risers away when he performed the annual pm's on the brine tanks.
 
Report This Post
posted Hide Post
VS, if your softener is set at 8 lbs of salt for each regeneration, I assume you have a 0.5 cu ft softener (8 lbs of salt will give you 15 lbs per cu ft, thus 30,000 grains per cuft capacity). You should dissolve about 2.2 lbs of salt per gallon of water, therefore you should have a little less than 4 gallons of water in the brine tank. The softener should automatically add this when the softener is in the Brine Refill step. If you don't get 4 gallons of water, adjust the time of the Brine Refill step. After 5 regenerations, you should need to add 40 lbs of salt.


The Water Guy - Florian Services
 
Posts: 617 | Location: Chicago | Registered: 24 January 2005Report This Post
  Powered by Social Strata Page 1 2 3  

Closed Topic Closed


Copyright RenalWEB 2014